The Sugaroo! Music Hour

[Jingle: Good Day Advertising: The Sugaroo! Music Hour]

Zanger: All right, everybody. Good morning, and welcome to Good Day Advertising. This is our first ever Sugaroo! Music Hour, right here on IndieHQ Radio. I'm Zanger. Here's the idea: once a month, our friends at Sugaroo! Music take the wheel and we build an hour around one theme. Today's theme is one every shop with a car account knows everything about: songs for automotive. 10 tracks, two lanes. The puns are going to be coming hot and heavy today. The first three have already done the job in car spots, and you'll hear why. The other seven haven't been placed yet, and they're ready for the spotlight. We think a few of them are ready to drive. More puns. If you're a creative, a producer or anyone who sits in the room when the music gets picked, this is your listening session. Every track lands on the show page, along with the licensing contact. Riding shotgun with me this morning and, let's be honest, really running the show: the senior vice president of Sugaroo!, Shawnté Salabert. Shawnté, good morning.

Shawnté: Well, good morning, Doug, and everybody listening. Just a quick disclaimer: that song you heard at the top of the show? That one's not ours.

Zanger: No, it's not. And I'm not going to sit here and lie. We use Suno. Everybody uses Suno. It's the greatest scratch-track thing ever. But we will always tell you: while it's fun to use, make sure you're hiring real musicians and real talent when it's time to get down to the music you're going to build or license for your work.

Shawnté: That's right.

Zanger: So, Shawnté, you've been doing this almost two decades, correct?

Shawnté: Yes, which is weird, because Michael likes to tell people I started when I was five years old.

Zanger: Right, Michael Nieves. Just want to make sure we get that right. He's the grand poobah at Sugaroo!

Shawnté: That's his technical title. Grand Poobah and Master of Ceremonies. I've been doing this a long time. I had zero background in it, although I do have a little background in advertising. I used to work as a studio assistant for a photographer, Craig Cameron Olsen, who shot a ton of what he called car porn, as I'm sure some of you do. That's how I learned this special ecosystem of car advertising, so it's fun to be on the other side of it. Listening to music, begging people to use the music, crying a little, laughing a little. All the emotions.

Zanger: So, Sugaroo! in one breath: music and licensing for film, TV, trailers, advertising and games, repping labels like Epitaph and ANTI-, which is my favorite label. Andy Shauf is one of my favorite artists, and if you listen to Andy Shauf, this morning is a complete 180 from what he sounds like. Mom+Pop, Yep Roc. So let's talk about cars and music, and why they go so well together.

Shawnté: Listen, car spots are interesting because the storytelling can run a thousand different ways, and music is such a heavy part of that storytelling. I went to a school's career day once, and I was trying to figure out how to explain music licensing. So I showed them a couple of spots dry, and then with the music, and they were like, "Oh yeah, that's great." With car spots, some people's brains go straight to dynamic driving and action. Other people go, "Oh, it's a sexy Lexus spot."

Zanger: Like the music we have under us right now.

Shawnté: Yeah, a sultry little start to your day. You've got family spots, togetherness. Sometimes people are going on a journey. To me, car spots are such a great way to discover music, because the music is usually so central. The storytelling you can do with automobiles is pretty incredible.

Zanger: For those of us who've been in this game for a minute, the classic would be VW and Nick Drake, "Pink Moon." That's one of the all-time classics.

Shawnté: Absolutely iconic. And that song got a whole second life after it appeared in that spot. Music discovery at its best.

Zanger: Well, let's get to the music. These are three songs that have already sold some cars. Let's get into the first lane. It's Good Day Advertising: The Sugaroo! Music Hour.

Zanger: All right, everybody. That was The Offspring, "Come Out and Play." Before that, Luciana with "Welcome to the Future," and we started with Shawn Lee's Ping Pong Orchestra featuring Nino Moschella on "Kiss the Sky." Three songs, three very different moods, and all three have sold cars. Shawnté Salabert from Sugaroo! Music, let's start with "Kiss the Sky." Where did that one run, and what made it click?

Shawnté: That was Lexus RZ. They wanted something that felt elevated, and you've got an almost cinematic feel to that song, with Nino Moschella in his soulful falsetto. It's moody. It's sexy. It's going to sell a nice little car. That spot had very little VO, and the vocal doesn't even come in until maybe halfway through, so the lyrics have to add to the spot. And it's interesting, because the lyrics aren't on the nose. They're not "and now we're driving a car." It's almost aspirational, this idea of kissing the sky. Something intangible. And you may not know the song's name, but I bet people hear it and think, "Oh, that's a little familiar." There's a slight familiarity without it being a big, known song. All of that came into play in that spot.

Zanger: And that's a remake.

Shawnté: It's not.

Zanger: Oh, no, wait. It's a different "Kiss the Sky."

Shawnté: It's an original. I mean, he's remade his own song, but it's an original.

Zanger: That's just us being undercaffeinated and very early.

Shawnté: I did wake up when The Offspring came on. There was some chair bouncing happening, so I'm good.

Zanger: That takes me back to my 94/7 alternative radio days in Portland. Nostalgia. All right, number two. "Welcome to the Future" builds around the one-minute mark. Is that what sold it? And where did it run?

Shawnté: That was a Jeep spot, and with that one, the lyrics needed to be a little on the nose. The whole spot is little shredders: kids skateboarding, BMX, snowboarding, all these kids just getting at it. The spot was about the next generation. So you've got this fun, poppy, electro track with a great beat, and really on-the-nose lyrics that sell the idea that these kids are the future. It was the lyrics and the sonic style, but it's also a little propulsive without being too driving. You don't want it to be too aggressive with a bunch of kids. It just landed.

Zanger: And then the aforementioned "Come Out and Play" by The Offspring, from 1994. Where did it run, and how did it end up there?

Shawnté: That was Mitsubishi Outlander.

Zanger: Oh my God. Like the Daewoo Leganza. Cars from a bygone era.

Shawnté: They wanted a recognizable song, and that song plays to nostalgia, but in a very different way than something emotional or warm or touchy-feely. It's nostalgia for people like you and me. We remember when we first heard that song and how it makes us feel. Even looking at the order of this show, I was like, "All right, let's go, Offspring." I'm ready to dance in my chair like I'm a teenager again. And it was chosen not just because it's recognizable, but because it plays against picture. The spot is about this sweater-wearing mom who's ready to live a more adventurous life. It's a humorous play, and those are my favorite spots.

Zanger: You've touched on this with these songs, but let's be instructive for anyone who just landed their first automotive account or is new to this. What does an automotive spot need from a song?

Shawnté: What does any spot need from a song? It's got to be part of the storytelling. You want people to come away from any spot identifying with that product, wanting it, or at least wanting to learn more about it. So you're deciding who your target audience is, and Lexus, Jeep and Mitsubishi are all different audiences. If I'm working with Lexus, maybe I want songs that are more elevated, slinky or sultry. I want someone to feel exclusive, a little higher end. Jeep, maybe you want something adventurous, something youthful. It's knowing your audience for that brand and understanding how to appeal to them. And it's not always "every time we do Jeep, we use this kind of song." That's the beauty of spots and how they change over a campaign or over many years. It's figuring out the audience for this specific vehicle and this specific spot, and finding the music that helps tell that story. That's the best part of music in ads: it's part of it, not just background noise.

Zanger: Exactly. Well, that's the proven lane. Now for the fun part: seven tracks that haven't landed in a car spot yet. Yet. Consider this your preview. Shawnté is going to tell us where they could land, and we'll kick off with the first three. It's Good Day Advertising: The Sugaroo! Music Hour.

[Sting: "In 500 feet, talk break. Sugaroo! Music Hour."]

Zanger: All right, welcome back. It's Good Day Advertising: The Sugaroo! Music Hour. I'm Zanger in Portland, at the mothership, and this music under us does sound like mothership music. Shawnté Salabert from Sugaroo! Music is with us.

Shawnté: It feels like home in my heart.

Zanger: It's got a little Tron thing going. All right, Mavis Staples, "Worthy." Oh, man.

Shawnté: That was a song inspired by Prince.

Zanger: We're going to talk about that in a second. Let me do my back-sell first. I'm a trained professional. Wink, wink. Before that, Dr. Dog with "Where'd All the Time Go?" and we kicked off this part of the spotlight lane with Lucius, "Until We Get There." None of these have been in a car spot yet.

Shawnté: It feels weird, but yes.

Zanger: I sat there after I got my coffee, headphones on, eyes closed, thinking, "That could work there, that could work there." So let's start with Lucius, "Until We Get There," from Wildewoman. That's Mom+Pop, right?

Shawnté: That's Mom+Pop.

Zanger: So how would you pitch this one? The car, the moment, the feeling.

Shawnté: You've got a cool indie artist with some cachet, and a song some people know, so there's familiarity. It also just sounds familiar, even if people can't place it. It's cool, but it's not hipster-exclusive. It has wide appeal. There's emotion and weight to it, but it still feels optimistic and hopeful, especially as it builds and gets more and more uplifting. You go on an emotional journey with this song, and that journey could be a metaphor or a literal one. Maybe it's a multigenerational spot where we see kids grow up to become drivers themselves, or somebody striking out on a new venture in a new city. There's something hopeful about it. That's the kind of spot I'd love to see it in. But really, any spot.

Zanger: That's the X in the algebra of this: sure, we'd like to see it in any spot. And you invoked hipster probably because I live in Portland, but that's OK. Dr. Dog: I love this band. ANTI- is the label, correct?

Shawnté: Yes. This song gets a lot of love, and somehow we just haven't gotten it to the car stage yet. Again, it's a cool artist with some cachet and that feeling of familiarity. I love it because it has a dreamy, nostalgic feel. Every time I listen to it, which is a lot, it makes me reflect on my own life. Lyrically, it could play a lot of ways. It's nostalgia. Maybe you're watching kids grow up again. (Got to get kids in there; they've got to drive at some point.) Or maybe you're thinking back to trips that were special, losing track of time in a really good way. Maybe you're out on the road just daydreaming, but not getting into an accident, of course. Stay safe out there, everyone.

Zanger: You said it hasn't been placed yet. When creatives and brands are discussing music, what are some of the things you hear that keep a song from getting over the finish line?

Shawnté: It's always a little bit of a mystery to me. We don't bother people too much when it doesn't work out. Sometimes it's simply that there was a more recognizable song people wanted, and that's often the client, not necessarily the creative team. Somebody on the brand side says, "I want somebody's mom to know this song." That happens more than people realize. And smart supervisors are out there quoting on a couple of songs at once, because they want to make sure they've got something clearable. We've gotten close with this one, and it just hasn't landed. But people love this song. It's probably one of the songs we get asked about and asked to ballpark the most. That one, I know, is going to happen.

Zanger: Hey, RPA: this is a great song for a Honda Pilot spot. Trust me.

Shawnté: Perfect Honda song.

Zanger: And then Mavis Staples. Holy powerhouse. Mavis is ANTI- too, right?

Shawnté: She is. You love the label, I love the label. Andy Kaulkin, the label head, has such a vision with it. With Mavis, you know her voice as soon as you hear it.

Zanger: Instantly.

Shawnté: Instantly. She's so recognizable, and that song is pure joy. It feels like a celebration. It's rhythmic, it's uplifting, and she was inspired by Prince with it. Lyrically, it's about feeling good about yourself. Sure, you could take it on the nose, being worthy of a great car. But to me it goes beyond that. It's an empowering song with a block-party feel, where everybody is celebrating, not just you. I'd love to see it in a spot where people are out in the streets feeling joyous.

Zanger: Quickly, I want to ask about fatigue. I'm trying to remember a song Microsoft used forever. It was really high-profile, with a female-empowerment vibe, and I can't remember the name right now.

Shawnté: It's on the tip of my tongue. One of us will come up with it at 8:01.

Zanger: Exactly. But talk about fatigue, and the importance of keeping things fresh, whether it's the same song showing up in a different category. What's that conversation like?

Shawnté: Of course it comes up. Sometimes people only want a song that's never been used before. But think about Darondo's "Didn't I." That was a crate-digger find from Andrew Jervis at Ubiquity. That song has been used in a lot of places on TV, and then it broke out into ads. It's funny, because it's a forlorn song. He's lamenting the loss of his love. But it gets used in so many spots, and it's not well known enough to feel played out. People who know it know it, and it's usually a delight when you hear it. I've been in stores and restaurants when it comes on overhead, and even I, who live with this song, feel happy. It's not like M83 playing in 7,000 trailers.

Zanger: Right.

Shawnté: For a lot of people it's still a discovery song. You get familiarity for some people and discovery for others, and that's an amazing way to use music in advertising.

Zanger: Well, let's discover a couple more, and then we'll come back and talk some more. It's Good Day Advertising: The Sugaroo! Music Hour.

[Sting: "Songs available for licensing. See Shawnté for details."]

Zanger: Alrighty, it's Good Day Advertising: The Sugaroo! Music Hour. I'm Zanger in Portland. Shawnté is down in L.A.

Shawnté: Where it's raining.

Zanger: It's doing the same up here.

Shawnté: It's like we're connected under the weather.

Zanger: You know what those are called in the biz? Service elements. Portland right now: 47 and rainy, with a high of 53. The clouds are going to break and it's going to be sunny-ish. Oh my God, how DJ was that?

Shawnté: Does that feel good in your soul, or bad?

Zanger: A little bit of both, let's be honest. My old program director would be proud I got the service elements in. All right: "Joy Rides" from Mamas Gun, and before that, Jontavious Willis, "A Lift Is All I Need." Let's start with "Joy Rides." That one kind of writes itself.

Shawnté: It really does. It's like, "Here I am. Use me."

Zanger: "Joy Rides" comes from Cheap Hotel. What's the label on that one?

Shawnté: That one's their own thing, Candelion. They've done stuff on majors before, but this was essentially self-released. They're a UK band, amazing, very much that retro vibe. Yes, the lyrics write themselves, but it's the feeling of it: it bursts into this big, almost disco-inspired retro chorus. It feels like the soundtrack to a road trip. I'm pretty sure I've listened to it while driving. You could have so much fun with the visuals.

Zanger: It feels Kia to me.

Shawnté: Totally Kia. I've probably pitched it to Kia before, honestly.

Zanger: Can something be too on the nose?

Shawnté: It depends on the spot. Of course something can be too on the nose. But there are so many ways to use music that I don't think it's always that way.

Zanger: Got you. Jontavious Willis, West Georgia Blues. What's the label on that one?

Shawnté: Strolling Bones, which is part of the New West Records family, a little label out of Athens. I love this one so much. He's a contemporary artist, but he sounds absolutely timeless. We get asked a lot for songs that are warm, organic and intimate, and this hits all those marks. It can still appeal across generations. It's not an "old people song."

Zanger: Right.

Shawnté: It's the simple instrumentation and the lyrics. A spot that doesn't use a lot of VO is going to want a song like this, something that helps tell the story and feels cozy and warm. You've got the literal lift of being in a car. I remember his label saying, "Get it in an Uber spot."

Zanger: That's funny.

Shawnté: We're aiming higher, OK? But there's also that emotional lift, feeling good. I want a lot of humans doing nice things, helping each other out, and I want this to be the soundtrack.

Zanger: You just mentioned something. I said Kia, you said Uber. How do you navigate it when an artist comes to you and says, "I think it could be in this"?

Shawnté: It's usually not the artist. It's usually the manager.

Zanger: The manager, sure.

Shawnté: Managers have big visions. And it's funny, because you mentioned being on the nose: a lot of the requests we get from managers to pitch songs for specific spots are very on-the-nose. My job is to service the music we represent. So if a manager wants me to pitch something, I'll usually send a separate email to the supervisor: "This artist just brought up this connection. I hadn't thought about it. Just putting it in your pocket for later." But when it comes to pitching for specific briefs, I'm sending you things that are right for the brief. That's why we have a good reputation. We're not sending a bunch of BS just because something's a priority, and I know a lot of majors have to do that. That's the nice thing about an indie like us: we're really looking at the brief, and a lot of us have deep relationships with supervisors after doing this so long. I'm not going to send something way off target. If I think there's something interesting, I'll say, "This one's a left-field choice, just in case you feel like listening." And we've licensed those before.

Zanger: That doesn't surprise me one bit. It's like an undiscovered gem.

Shawnté: Yep. Sometimes the song you wouldn't think of pitching is the one that lands. It's always a delight.

Zanger: All right, I want to shift gears here for a second. Pun intended. You have a podcast. Everybody has a podcast.

Shawnté: Everyone has a pod.

Zanger: Tell me about yours.

Shawnté: Mine has nothing to do with music, of course. I have a whole separate side life. I'm an outdoor writer. I've written my second book, and I just got the cover art from my publisher yesterday. And my podcast is called Gear Abby, as in Dear Abby.

Zanger: I got it.

Shawnté: People of a certain age understand. I love a pun. I answer people's questions about all things outdoors: people, places, products, pastimes. We've been around a year and just won an outdoor media award. I love music and I love this work, but it's really satisfying to have a completely separate part of your life to dig into. And there's a lot of overlap. I know a lot of supervisors who hike and like to get outside. We talk about backpacking bidets a lot on that show. People ask a lot of questions about going to the bathroom outside.

Zanger: I'm sure they do. And to be very clear, since this is an advertising-centric show: when Shawnté says outdoor, she doesn't mean out-of-home.

Shawnté: We're rolling around in the dirt on my show.

Zanger: Have you hiked up this way, in Oregon?

Shawnté: Absolutely. I've been to the Gorge and hiked little bits of the PCT up there. My first book was about the Southern California PCT.

Zanger: That's the Pacific Crest Trail, for those who don't know, or who've seen the film Wild.

Shawnté: I am Cheryl Strayed. That's my alter ego. The Pacific Crest Trail runs from Campo, at the Mexican border, up to Canada. It's named the Pacific Crest Trail because it mostly follows the high mountain ranges.

Zanger: And it is a bear, even if you only do small sections of it. All right, we've got a couple more to go. It's Good Day Advertising: The Sugaroo! Music Hour. Here's what we've got cooking next.